OOTB Carolina Basketball Discussion Thread

[TarHeelNation11]

I dunno, I bet Roy was secretly happy. This way he can start 7th over Jalek, which will cause us to lose us a couple games in the OOC, which will piss off the fan base he likes shitting on so much, and yet he'll still have Berry come back by the times the games matter in conference play.

Sounds like a Roy wet dream to me.

And then win another natty just to totally leave us not knowing what just happened lol. My monthly thoughts on Roy during the (real) months of college basketball season go like this:

December: Annoyed (we lose to someone like Indiana away and look awful in doing so).
January: Pleased (we go undefeated in January)
February: Angry beyond measure (first loss to Duke) giving way to pleased (we win all our other games that month, save one or two)
March: Annoyed x2 (lose to Duke again, and then lose a winnable game in ACCT); Giving way to super pleased (we're rolling in NCAAT)
April: Nowadays, usually fairly pleased lol

 

[nctransplant]

Absolutely. How could he possibly be a HOF coach without reading all of gary's suggestions?

That's a different situation. G7 has a direct line to his office, kinda like the direct line between the Whitehouse and Moscow, the commissioner and Batman, etc.

 

[heelmanwilm]

NBA2K

Word is it was a blown assist

 

[JuleZ '02 HEEL]

Anybody shocked? Anybody?

 

[tarheel0910]

Word is it was a blown assist

 

[nctransplant]

Anybody shocked? Anybody?

View embedded media

Are they lovers?

 

[tarheel0910]

Anybody shocked? Anybody?

View embedded media

JJ is a complete douche, but he's one of those players that UNC fans would have loved if he had played for us.

 

[heelz2345]

JJ is a complete douche, but he's one of those players that UNC fans would have loved if he had played for us.

Loved is a strong word. I would have had a higher tolerance for his douchebaggery, true, but not sure I could go full on "love."

 

[tarheel0910]

Loved is a strong word. I would have had a higher tolerance for his douchebaggery, true, but not sure I could go full on "love."

Maybe love is too strong, but players like Sheed and McCants had a similar type of attitude and no one had a problem with them while they were here.

 

[coolwaterunc]

Maybe love is too strong, but players like Sheed and McCants had a similar type of attitude and no one had a problem with them while they were here.

I know this is most likely because of K, but I hated JJ (and now Allen) more because of his flopping and flailing more than just being a pure douche.

 

[tarheel0910]

I know this is most likely because of K, but I hated JJ (and now Allen) more because of his flopping and flailing more than just being a pure douche.

Surely you're not suggesting duke players are a little "dramatic" on the court. @tw3301 say it ain't so.

 

[heelz2345]

It's not necessarily the cocky, like @coolwaterunc said, it's the flopping and other stuff. The thing I always said about Redick though is that he could back it up so I didn't mind his cockiness that much. Guys like Paulus who had the same sort of demeanor but 1/20th the talent were the guys who really bugged me. Grayson has the cocky and the talent, but it's extra stuff with the tripping and whatnot that really grind my gears.

 

[coolwaterunc]

It's not necessarily the cocky, like @coolwaterunc said, it's the flopping and other stuff. The thing I always said about Redick though is that he could back it up so I didn't mind his cockiness that much. Guys like Paulus who had the same sort of demeanor but 1/20th the talent were the guys who really bugged me. Grayson has the cocky and the talent, but it's extra stuff with the tripping and whatnot that really grind my gears.

You summed up my thoughts perfectly.

As for Paulus, he's probably my favorite Duke player ever, actually. I got so much joy out of watching him get abused by our players time after time that I looked forward to watching him play.

 

[nctransplant]

It's not necessarily the cocky, like @coolwaterunc said, it's the flopping and other stuff. The thing I always said about Redick though is that he could back it up so I didn't mind his cockiness that much. Guys like Paulus who had the same sort of demeanor but 1/20th the talent were the guys who really bugged me. Grayson has the cocky and the talent, but it's extra stuff with the tripping and whatnot that really grind my gears.

I like it when Mickey flops around, just ask @tw3301 .

 

[nctransplant]

If you Jackwagons remember earlier I said Theo might play some Point Forward? Well in the presser today he said he has been running some at the 1 which is very similar. You're welcome.

Also G7 changed his thoughts on the matter but claimed he didn't see the presser.

 

[gunslingerdick]

If you Jackwagons remember earlier I said Theo might play some Point Forward? Well in the presser today he said he has been running some at the 1 which is very similar. You're welcome.

If Theo keeps beating everyone in video games he might have to play all 5 positions.

 

[nctransplant]

If Theo keeps beating everyone in video games he might have to play all 5 positions.

I'm telling you it's just one of the many offensive improvements to his game this year.

 

[tw3301]

It's not necessarily the cocky, like @coolwaterunc said, it's the flopping and other stuff. The thing I always said about Redick though is that he could back it up so I didn't mind his cockiness that much. Guys like Paulus who had the same sort of demeanor but 1/20th the talent were the guys who really bugged me. Grayson has the cocky and the talent, but it's extra stuff with the tripping and whatnot that really grind my gears.

Loved Redick, hated Paulus with a passion and still do. Paulus was a bitch on the court and in the locker room. You guys love Hansbrough, you would have loved Redick had he played at UNC.

I like it when Mickey flops around, just ask @tw3301 .

GFY

If you Jackwagons remember earlier I said Theo might play some Point Forward? Well in the presser today he said he has been running some at the 1 which is very similar. You're welcome.

Also G7 changed his thoughts on the matter but claimed he didn't see the presser.

****ing hilarious.

 

[TarHeelNation11]

JJ is a complete douche, but he's one of those players that UNC fans would have loved if he had played for us.

Fact. Anyone who disputes it is lying or using revisionist history. For an example, see...

Loved Redick, hated Paulus with a passion and still do. Paulus was a bitch on the court and in the locker room. You guys love Hansbrough, you would have loved Redick had he played at UNC.

If Hansbrough had gone to Duke and had the same exact career he had here, he would be the most hated Blue Devil by Carolina fans of all time.

 

[gunslingerdick]

Fact. Anyone who disputes it is lying or using revisionist history. For an example, see...


If Hansbrough had gone to Duke and had the same exact career he had here, he would be the most hated Blue Devil by Carolina fans of all time.

Was Hansbrough also a poet?

 

[Archer2]

It's not necessarily the cocky, like @coolwaterunc said, it's the flopping and other stuff. The thing I always said about Redick though is that he could back it up so I didn't mind his cockiness that much. Guys like Paulus who had the same sort of demeanor but 1/20th the talent were the guys who really bugged me. Grayson has the cocky and the talent, but it's extra stuff with the tripping and whatnot that really grind my gears.

My thoughts exactly.

 

[heelz2345]

I think the “had JJ come to UNC” thing is sort of moot because if he had come to UNC he wouldn’t have had the same career by a long shot. Roy doesn’t use the 3 often enough to facilitate the same numbers, Roy’s rotation is longer than K’s, meaning less minutes, and he would have shared the court his first three years with May, Felton, and McCants, leading to fewer shot attempts. Now sure, if he had come to UNC and had the exact same career somehow despite those things, I probably would love him and overlook the poetry and whatnot, but I don’t see that as being possible.

 

[heelz2345]

Similarly, Hansbrough wouldn’t have had the career he had at UNC had he gone to Duke. He would have been a Brian Zoubek or something, setting screens for shooters, grabbing boards and getting trash buckets because the offense isn’t geared toward his position. Hansbrough and Redick had the careers they did because they were perfect fits for those coaches at those schools.

 

[tarheel0910]

Similarly, Hansbrough wouldn’t have had the career he had at UNC had he gone to Duke. He would have been a Brian Zoubek or something, setting screens for shooters, grabbing boards and getting trash buckets because the offense isn’t geared toward his position. Hansbrough and Redick had the careers they did because they were perfect fits for those coaches at those schools.

I'm not really talking about their career, I'm talking about the personality.

 

[heelz2345]

I'm not really talking about their career, I'm talking about the personality.

Well for me, I am willing to overlook personality flaws the better a player is. There are a number of reasons Rasheed is remembered more favorably than say Will Graves, one of which being, he was way better

 

[heelz2345]

I think their career is directly linked to how much these guys are hated. If Hansbrough had been a middle of the road player at Duke, I just don’t see him being the all-time most hated Duke player over Laettner, Hurley or Redick. For most people hatred is directly tied to success, So I think that has to be taken into consideration

 

[tarheel0910]

I think their career is directly linked to how much these guys are hated. If Hansbrough had been a middle of the road player at Duke, I just don’t see him being the all-time most hated Duke player over Laettner, Hurley or Redick. For most people hatred is directly tied to success, So I think that has to be taken into consideration

Given their level of talent they still would have had a good career. It might not have been as good, but it would have been good enough to hate.

 

[heelz2345]

Given their level of talent they still would have had a good career. It might not have been as good, but it would have been good enough to hate.

I’ll concede that but I think there would be a severe reduction in the hate they both receive. Neither would really have been good enough to still be super hated a decade after their careers ended

 

[coryfly]

I don't mind JJ now. He has pretty much admitted he was a huge douche for a while, which is more self-awareness than most show. He also was extremely gracious regarding Hansbrough when he passed him in scoring.

 

[TarHeelNation11]

Yeah I'm sticking to my guns on this comment. I seriously doubt anyone who says they think otherwise, tbh:

Fact. Anyone who disputes it is lying or using revisionist history. For an example... If Hansbrough had gone to Duke and had the same exact career he had here, he would be the most hated Blue Devil by Carolina fans of all time.

 

[TarHeelNation11]

Was Hansbrough also a poet?

Nope, but he was all of the following. Stop me when it sounds like a typical Duke player we all hate:
- white
- gets away with dishing out a lot of contact
- gets a lotttttt of calls, some being of the suspect variety
- uncoordinated-looking
- knack for coming through in the clutch and slamming the door shut on the opponent's run, when it looked like we might lose

 

[heelz2345]

Yeah I'm sticking to my guns on this comment. I seriously doubt anyone who says they think otherwise, tbh:

I don't necessarily disagree with this, yeah, if he did all the exact same things but for Duke, there's a good chance I would hate him. My point is, it would have required an entirely different offensive philosophy from K for him to have had the exact same career there and I don't believe Hansbrough would have put up nearly the same numbers there that he did here. Josh McRoberts was the #2 recruit the same class as Hansbrough, he averaged 10.8 PPG for his two year career at Duke. Hansbrough's worst scoring year at UNC was 5 PPG higher than McRoberts' best year. Brian Zoubek was top 25 the class after, career average of 4 PPG and 4.5 RPG. K would not have made Hansbrough the focus. So would I have hated a guy who would have been the 3rd or 4th best player on his team due to how K runs his offense as much as I hate the usual suspects on the most hated Duke list? No. I would have hated him at the time and forgot about it until years later when someone goes "hey, remember this guy?" and I say "Oh yeah, totally forgot about him, but I hated that dude."

The same is true for Redick at UNC. He wouldn't have had the success. The fewest 3's he attempted in a year was 238, with two seasons having at least 300 attempted. There have only been 3 times since Roy has been here a player shot 230 3's in a season, Marcus Paige in 2015 and Justin and Berry in 2017. None of them reached 300 attempts. His fewest 3's made in a season was 95, 3 times going over 100. Justin in 2017 was the only time a Tar Heel has hit 95+ in a season. So Redick's numbers would have dropped significantly in Chapel Hill because Roy wouldn't want someone shooting that many 3's, especially right when he got there.


Again, success is the main reason for hatred. If Tyler Hansbrough averaged Isaiah Hicks career numbers, there would be no real hatred once he left. If Redick averaged Quinn Cook numbers, no one would remember him. I don't think either player would have had the career they did had they switched shades of blue, so I don't think you can say "they would be as hated/loved as the other," in large part because they both would have been bad fits in the opposite offense. The whole thing is a pointless exercise, both played where they went, had the careers they had, and that's it. We love the ones we love and hate the ones we hate.

 

[TarHeelNation11]

I don't necessarily disagree with this, yeah, if he did all the exact same things but for Duke, there's a good chance I would hate him. My point is, it would have required an entirely different offensive philosophy from K for him to have had the exact same career there and I don't believe Hansbrough would have put up nearly the same numbers there that he did here. Josh McRoberts was the #2 recruit the same class as Hansbrough, he averaged 10.8 PPG for his two year career at Duke. Hansbrough's worst scoring year at UNC was 5 PPG higher than McRoberts' best year. Brian Zoubek was top 25 the class after, career average of 4 PPG and 4.5 RPG. K would not have made Hansbrough the focus. So would I have hated a guy who would have been the 3rd or 4th best player on his team due to how K runs his offense as much as I hate the usual suspects on the most hated Duke list? No. I would have hated him at the time and forgot about it until years later when someone goes "hey, remember this guy?" and I say "Oh yeah, totally forgot about him, but I hated that dude."

The same is true for Redick at UNC. He wouldn't have had the success. The fewest 3's he attempted in a year was 238, with two seasons having at least 300 attempted. There have only been 3 times since Roy has been here a player shot 230 3's in a season, Marcus Paige in 2015 and Justin and Berry in 2017. None of them reached 300 attempts. His fewest 3's made in a season was 95, 3 times going over 100. Justin in 2017 was the only time a Tar Heel has hit 95+ in a season. So Redick's numbers would have dropped significantly in Chapel Hill because Roy wouldn't want someone shooting that many 3's, especially right when he got there.


Again, success is the main reason for hatred. If Tyler Hansbrough averaged Isaiah Hicks career numbers, there would be no real hatred once he left. If Redick averaged Quinn Cook numbers, no one would remember him. I don't think either player would have had the career they did had they switched shades of blue, so I don't think you can say "they would be as hated/loved as the other," in large part because they both would have been bad fits in the opposite offense. The whole thing is a pointless exercise, both played where they went, had the careers they had, and that's it. We love the ones we love and hate the ones we hate.

You're way over-thinking it DSouthr. I said if he played for Duke and had the same kind of career

 

[heelz2345]

You're way over-thinking it DSouthr. I said if he played for Duke and had the same kind of career

Sure, and I get that. I just don't think either could have the same career.

 

[TarHeelNation11]

Sure, and I get that. I just don't think either could have the same career.

Yeah, but they didn't go to Duke so it's kinda moot... lol

 

[tarheel0910]

Stop me when it sounds like a typical Duke player we all hate:
- white

Stop.

 

[TarHeelNation11]

Stop.

Perfect response lol.

 

[JuleZ '02 HEEL]

I admit that I can fairly easily picture not liking Hansbrough if he had been in the other shade of blue.

But I'm having a really hard time imagining a universe in which I would like JJ Reddick.

 

[gunslingerdick]

I don’t think it’s groubdgreaking logic to suggest we have a bias against duke players because they played at duke and to overlook certain things about our own players. I have no trouble calling Redick a douche while at the same time acknowledging I’d go to war for someone calling Hansbrough that. I’m a Carolina fan. I thought that was how this rivalry thing worked.

 

[JuleZ '02 HEEL]

I don’t think it’s groubdgreaking logic to suggest we have a bias against duke players because they played at duke and to overlook certain things about our own players. I have no trouble calling Redick a douche while at the same time acknowledging I’d go to war for someone calling Hansbrough that. I’m a Carolina fan. I thought that was how this rivalry thing worked.

I agree.