OOTB Carolina Basketball Discussion Thread
- Thread starter carolinablue34
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No Final Four this year, Ratface . . suck it.
In the past 3 years, Duke has had the #1 recruiting class each year. What they have to show for it: 1 Elite 8, 1 Sweet 16, 1 2nd round, 1 ACCT title, 0 ACC Regular Season titles. If Roy did that with that talent, he’d be crucified.
Hell Roy has 2 final fours, and a natty and he get bitched about
KARMA = Watching his last second shot in regulation go around the rim twice and hang in front until it fell off..... So Close
I guess Luke Maye could teach Grayson a thing or two about hitting a game winning shot to send your team to the final four. Ain’t it great? 
dook has only 1 shared ACC regular season title in the last 12 years...
Ah, I can rest easy now. Their post season success is not what it once was no doubt about it.
Thank God for Kansas (said no one ever except me just now).
Thank God for Kansas (said no one ever except me just now).
I don't understand the hate that some UNC fans have for KU. There is no reason for us to hate them.
Yeah, I don't mind KU at all. Really, it is just Duke and State for me tbh. There are teams I pull for more than others but I really just want to see those two go down.
I would add UK to that list. Maybe not the same level of hate as moo and duke, but UK fans are ****ing assholes.
I don't want them to win but I can pull for them in certain situations. Like for this bracket contest I picked them so cheered for them. I had a local connection to their team a few years back so didn't mind seeing them win some. I picked Duke to lose to KU as well but was not pulling for Duke up to this point. I would have preferred they lose the first game. If I used to coach a player who pulled for them I would still want them to lose. So there is a definite difference for me, haha.
guilty as charged
Duke's last ACC Regular season title was in 2010. They won in 06 before that.
Our titles since 2006 - 07, 08, 09, 11, 12, 16. and 17
Yep, and to give you an idea of how long ago it was, that one was shared with Maryland.
For reference, in that same window, UNC won or shared 7, UVA won or shared 4, and Miami won 1
We also have more national titles since Roy came home. (3-2).
K has us beat in recruiting class titles though. Oh well, can't win them all.
I was actually referring to the actual state and not the basketball team haha.
In reality I have nothing against the Jayhawks.
With 10 players who were top 50 recruits, 5 of whom were top 20, 2 were top 10.
That group was really underwhelming. It’s proof that dook is getting better talent than they are by basically copying what they were doing haha.
If only Roy would just call more timeouts we'd be more successful.
Well, Kansas booted us out of a few memorable NCAA Tourney's. And, that was Roy's old school. There's a sense of... uneasiness? Also, there was Larry Brown's tenure and Danny Manning. Not to mention, they steel from the blue-blood spotlight that UNC wants to have for itself.
I noticed a lot of people on THR hoping the dookies fail for an extended period. That would be awful, in my opinion. Maybe for a season or two, at the very most. If they aren't successful, the rivalry falters and the love of the game goes down, from my perspective. It's great to win, we know that. But, if all you ever do is win... it seems like the wins might get old.
I always wonder what it was like as a UCLA fan in the late 60's and early 70's. I guess winning all the time never gets old, I dunno. For me, it's like, how can you know if you prefer hot if you've never experienced cold?
This is undoubtedly one of the dumbest poasts you have ever made. Who in the hell wants to ever lose? I want to go undefeated every year. Why would you ever compete if you didn't want to win? Winning never gets old.
Duke may be getting better talent, but I don't think they are getting better results.
Since Cal went to UK in 2010 (9 years), he has 1 national title, 4 total Final Fours, 6 total Elite Eights, 7 Sweet Sixteens, 5 SEC regular season titles and 6 SEC tournament championships.
Same window, Duke has 2 national titles (but only 1 was with one and dones), 2 total Final Fours, 4 total Elite Eights, 6 Sweet Sixteens, 1 ACC regular season title and 3 ACC tournament championships.
So I think Cal has been more successful overall with the one and done format than K
I had this thought today, and maybe you guys have as well, but I think part of the reason K has committed to the one and done formula is because he was slipping behind Roy (and to some extent Cal). The first true one and done that Duke had since the rule was implemented was Kyrie Irving in 2011. Prior to Irving, since Roy returned to UNC, the head to head record in the rivalry was 7-7, but Roy had won 2 titles, had 3 Final Fours, 4 ACC regular seasons, and I think the straw that broke K's back was losing Harrison Barnes to us. I think at that point, K decided he was going to go for one and done guys, and hope that the talent he brought in would be good enough to beat whoever.
He has had some success with it, but really, I don't think he's been more successful with this strategy than he was before and the argument could be made he's been less successful. The past 8 years since he has committed to bring in OAD's (11-18) has seen 1 National Championship, 1 Final Four, 0 ACC regular seasons, and 2 ACCT's where the 8 years before that time (03-10) saw 1 National Title, 2 Final Fours, 3 ACC regular seasons, and 5 ACCT's. Meanwhile Roy has been pretty much equally successful in both of those windows because he stayed the course.
Anyway, I know it's a long poast, but the gist is K sucks.
He has had some success with it, but really, I don't think he's been more successful with this strategy than he was before and the argument could be made he's been less successful. The past 8 years since he has committed to bring in OAD's (11-18) has seen 1 National Championship, 1 Final Four, 0 ACC regular seasons, and 2 ACCT's where the 8 years before that time (03-10) saw 1 National Title, 2 Final Fours, 3 ACC regular seasons, and 5 ACCT's. Meanwhile Roy has been pretty much equally successful in both of those windows because he stayed the course.
Anyway, I know it's a long poast, but the gist is K sucks.
Well, you know the difference! You have to apply the polarity to understand what I was referring to. I'm not saying "I want the team to lose."
The UNC/NCSU rivalry died. It's a memory now. It may be difficult for you to grasp, but, when it was a rivalry, it was more fun to experience. You don't think the same way I think. Big shock!
I think that's a little too over-the-top. I doubt K is that obsessed with Roy Williams. He's obsessed with himself. He's going to do whatever will maintain his name being in the conversation about college basketball. I'm sure he doesn't like "losing" recruits to UNC, or losing anything to UNC. But, I don't think that losing recruits to UNC would compel him to totally abandon his coaching scheme. I think K also saw the success (or what appeared to be success) that Calipari was having and he wanted to go that route even more. The whole competition of bagging the best recruits became something else he had to be "the best at" as well. Those OAD players are never going to be as committed to their schools as 3 and 4 year players.I had this thought today, and maybe you guys have as well, but I think part of the reason K has committed to the one and done formula is because he was slipping behind Roy (and to some extent Cal). The first true one and done that Duke had since the rule was implemented was Kyrie Irving in 2011. Prior to Irving, since Roy returned to UNC, the head to head record in the rivalry was 7-7, but Roy had won 2 titles, had 3 Final Fours, 4 ACC regular seasons, and I think the straw that broke K's back was losing Harrison Barnes to us. I think at that point, K decided he was going to go for one and done guys, and hope that the talent he brought in would be good enough to beat whoever.
He has had some success with it, but really, I don't think he's been more successful with this strategy than he was before and the argument could be made he's been less successful. The past 8 years since he has committed to bring in OAD's (11-18) has seen 1 National Championship, 1 Final Four, 0 ACC regular seasons, and 2 ACCT's where the 8 years before that time (03-10) saw 1 National Title, 2 Final Fours, 3 ACC regular seasons, and 5 ACCT's. Meanwhile Roy has been pretty much equally successful in both of those windows because he stayed the course.
Anyway, I know it's a long poast, but the gist is K sucks.
UNC had no choice but to take what they could get during the NCAA investigation. Roy did wonders with those kids who came to the Hill.
If this FBI deal breaks the college mold, I think UNC will be better equipped to handle it.
I had this thought today, and maybe you guys have as well, but I think part of the reason K has committed to the one and done formula is because he was slipping behind Roy (and to some extent Cal). The first true one and done that Duke had since the rule was implemented was Kyrie Irving in 2011. Prior to Irving, since Roy returned to UNC, the head to head record in the rivalry was 7-7, but Roy had won 2 titles, had 3 Final Fours, 4 ACC regular seasons, and I think the straw that broke K's back was losing Harrison Barnes to us. I think at that point, K decided he was going to go for one and done guys, and hope that the talent he brought in would be good enough to beat whoever.
He has had some success with it, but really, I don't think he's been more successful with this strategy than he was before and the argument could be made he's been less successful. The past 8 years since he has committed to bring in OAD's (11-18) has seen 1 National Championship, 1 Final Four, 0 ACC regular seasons, and 2 ACCT's where the 8 years before that time (03-10) saw 1 National Title, 2 Final Fours, 3 ACC regular seasons, and 5 ACCT's. Meanwhile Roy has been pretty much equally successful in both of those windows because he stayed the course.
Anyway, I know it's a long poast, but the gist is K sucks.
I agree with this, and it's important to remember that this was after the dominant run UNC had with the Tyler, Green and Ellington teams. That four year span from 06-09 included 3 ACC titles, 2 Tournament titles and 1 NC. I'm sure all that sent K over the edge.
I had this thought today, and maybe you guys have as well, but I think part of the reason K has committed to the one and done formula is because he was slipping behind Roy (and to some extent Cal). The first true one and done that Duke had since the rule was implemented was Kyrie Irving in 2011. Prior to Irving, since Roy returned to UNC, the head to head record in the rivalry was 7-7, but Roy had won 2 titles, had 3 Final Fours, 4 ACC regular seasons, and I think the straw that broke K's back was losing Harrison Barnes to us. I think at that point, K decided he was going to go for one and done guys, and hope that the talent he brought in would be good enough to beat whoever.
He has had some success with it, but really, I don't think he's been more successful with this strategy than he was before and the argument could be made he's been less successful. The past 8 years since he has committed to bring in OAD's (11-18) has seen 1 National Championship, 1 Final Four, 0 ACC regular seasons, and 2 ACCT's where the 8 years before that time (03-10) saw 1 National Title, 2 Final Fours, 3 ACC regular seasons, and 5 ACCT's. Meanwhile Roy has been pretty much equally successful in both of those windows because he stayed the course.
Anyway, I know it's a long poast, but the gist is K sucks.
Maybe Roy’s success in the Hansbrough years had a little something to do with it but I think it’s more that K is simply numbers chasing at this point. That’s why he’s abandoned pretty much everything he ever stood for to go the way of a program that’s conducive to OADs. The duke culture that he worked so hard to build which was based on leadership, discipline, defense, grittiness and outsmarting and outworking everyone is completely gone. The duke culture is now one that is much flashier yet less effective. But k doesn’t care because he knows he’s at the end. He’s showing that he doesn’t give a rat’s ass (pun intended) about the program after he’s gone. Because what he’s building isn’t a sustainable model. He knows it. He just wants so badly to pile up more numbers and have people talk about his greatness. He’s the opposite of Dean Smith.
In short, I concur. K sucks.
I mean, I don't think he was obsessed with us either, but in a relatively short period of time, he went from the unquestioned top dog that he had been in the ACC following Dean's retirement to having Roy edge in on his territory. But I think the point you made of being obsessed with himself does tie in to what I was saying. He couldn't handle not being "the best" and so he changed strategy for what he thought would be the best way to keep winning games, and by getting the top recruits, he does keep his name and Duke's name in the media whether or not they get results at the end of the year or not.
Yeah, I think a lot of that is spot on. The guy wants to be known as the greatest, and there's nothing inherently wrong with that, but I think the past several years he has definitely sold out whatever integrity he had to chase those numbers.
This is the more likely explanation.
Talent wins, but as we’ve seen the past few years, it doesn’t mean much if it doesn’t gel. And as was pointed out, those OAD Kentucky and Duke teams that won championships also had upperclassman leadership on them.
But I still want the top kids. It’s good for our brand and image.
Oh, yeah. And, that's sort of "winning" in and of itself. W's and L's are one thing, and titles and banners are great, but he's still got Duke on the tip of everyone's tongue. And, these OAD players see Duke as the best location to highlight their abilities and show off how good they are for a few months.
And, you know, I was thinking about yesterday's game. You get to the Elite 8 and you've had a really good year. I'm glad they won't get a FF banner or NCAA banner, but, they went pretty far. If they could have lost in the first two rounds (like last year), then that feels better. Once you get to the EE, you're vindicated!
I'm hoping the college model is revamped and these OAD guys will bypass college altogether. Some people enjoy what they've brought to the college game. I don't care for it.
I want good kids and I am confident that Roy Williams will find the good kids for him and the UNC brand. And, I believe he will get the most out of the ones he does get to commit to UNC.
