OOTB Carolina Basketball Discussion Thread

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

If you want a coach like shushefskee, go pull for them.

I don't think is completely fair. Fans and alumni can't exactly just pick up and cheer for another team. And I don't think it's wrong to see the good qualities in other coaches and wish that your own coach would emulate some of those.

And, I remember tourney losses a helluva lot more than I remember a regular season loss (or win) against dook. It's a regular season game. It doesn't make-or-break anything. I love rivalries, but I'm not losing my shit over those one-game-events in a basketball season.

This I completely agree with. In all the sports I watch, I've seen way too many great teams fall flat on their face in the playoffs, and some so-so teams get hot in the playoffs and win it all to really get too wrapped up in the regular season. Other than college football, regular seasons are meaningless. College football is the opposite, where the regular season means everything, and the postseason means nothing (unless its a playoff game or conference championship - the other bowls are pretty meaningless).

 

[tarheel0910]

College football is the opposite, where the regular season means everything, and the postseason means nothing (unless its a playoff game or conference championship - the other bowls are pretty meaningless).

So you didn't get all pumped up for the awesomeness that was the sun bowl?

 

[coolwaterunc]

As much as I would love to sit here and tell everyone that it's just another regular season game and that it's not a big deal...sorry, it isn't just another regular season game, and it is a big deal. Whether it should be or not, it is. Want our recruiting to improve? Getting beat by our biggest competition eight miles down the road on a national stage on a regular basis doesn't really help matters much. As much as I wish the media hasn't hyped this game up to be the Super Bowl of the college basketball season, they have, so yeah, it's a big deal. Getting our asses handed to us on such a big stage on a regular basis isn't a good thing, sorry. Is it as important as the tournament? Absolutely not, and I'll even say that I've completely forgotten about the Duke games by the time the tournament starts. Even so, to say that it's just another regular season game is a little ignorant, IMO.

 

[Blue2010]

As much as I would love to sit here and tell everyone that it's just another regular season game and that it's not a big deal...sorry, it isn't just another regular season game, and it is a big deal. Whether it should be or not, it is. Want our recruiting to improve? Getting beat by our biggest competition eight miles down the road on a national stage on a regular basis doesn't really help matters much. As much as I wish the media hasn't hyped this game up to be the Super Bowl of the college basketball season, they have, so yeah, it's a big deal. Getting our asses handed to us on such a big stage on a regular basis isn't a good thing, sorry. Is it as important as the tournament? Absolutely not, and I'll even say that I've completely forgotten about the Duke games by the time the tournament starts. Even so, to say that it's just another regular season game is a little ignorant, IMO.

I promise you -- the biggest recruiting tool any school has is the NBA. These kids in high school want to get paid. They will migrate to the school that gives them the best chance at achieving that. I would bet everything I have on the belief that 90+ percent of high school players value that way more than how the team plays against other schools. In the player's mind...they would make the difference and change that outcome.

Put kids in the League, you get more kids.

 

[coolwaterunc]

I promise you -- the biggest recruiting tool any school has is the NBA. These kids in high school want to get paid. They will migrate to the school that gives them the best chance at achieving that. I would bet everything I have on the belief that 90+ percent of high school players value that way more than how the team plays against other schools. In the player's mind...they would make the difference and change that outcome.

Put kids in the League, you get more kids.

I don't disagree with that at all. Just saying it doesn't help if you keep getting beat by the other team recruits are considering time after time after time.

 

[Blue2010]

I don't disagree with that at all. Just saying it doesn't help if you keep getting beat by the other team recruits are considering time after time after time.

Not sure if anyone else thinks this, but I'm going out on the limb anyway. It feels like Roy goes after guys that have a higher moral character than Duke. Roy gets the "nice guys"...I follow a lot of these guys on Twitter, and you could easily see Justin Jackson becoming a church pastor one day. Zeller was an academic All American... I have always thought you have to have at least one "junkyard dog" on every team...I'm not sure I see one with this group, other than maybe Pinson.

 

[toophly1124]

I have always thought you have to have at least one "junkyard dog" on every team...I'm not sure I see one with this group, other than maybe Pinson.

Apparently you don't visit radar that often.

 

[TarHeelMark]

I listened to the radio broadcast instead, which was actually about 10 seconds behind the network broadcast. That's pretty typical, I've found.

I do this all the time but pause the tv feed for 7-10 seconds or whatever and get it all synced up.

 

[Blue2010]

Apparently you don't visit radar that often.

Never, actually. I value my brain cells. What do they say on the matter?

 

[toophly1124]

Never, actually. I value my brain cells. What do they say on the matter?

'Junk yard dog' is what G7 coined as a nickname for Berry.

 

[Raising Heel]

I think the tipping point for me was the Rivers shot at the buzzer.

Rivers over Zeller was probably the closest I've ever been to becoming a psychopath.

That shot didn't end my marriage, but it sure didn't help when I yelled G**D***** at the top of my lungs. Pets scattered, the ex nearly had a heart attack, just a bad scene all around. And I despise that word.

 

[Raising Heel]

I have always thought you have to have at least one "junkyard dog" on every team...I'm not sure I see one with this group, other than maybe Pinson.

How dare you.

 

[Raising Heel]

I do this all the time but pause the tv feed for 7-10 seconds or whatever and get it all synced up.

My network feed is via antenna, not cable. No way to pause it unless I finally figure out how to manipulate the space-time continuum.

 

[Blue2010]

That shot didn't end my marriage, but it sure didn't help when I yelled G**D***** at the top of my lungs. Pets scattered, the ex nearly had a heart attack, just a bad scene all around. And I despise that word.

I cannot stand that word either. That shot...I came very close.

 

[Blue2010]

'Junk yard dog' is what G7 coined as a nickname for Berry.

Interesting. I would advise G7 to rewatch the tape last night.

 

[JuleZ '02 HEEL]

My network feed is via antenna, not cable. No way to pause it unless I finally figure out how to manipulate the space-time continuum.

Or spring for a Tivo Bolt.

 

[Raising Heel]

Or spring for a Tivo Bolt.

Don't care, and don't want another clunky piece of A/V equipment to deal with tbh. I'm all about the downsizing right now.

 

[tarheel0910]

Not sure if anyone else thinks this, but I'm going out on the limb anyway. It feels like Roy goes after guys that have a higher moral character than Duke. Roy gets the "nice guys"...I follow a lot of these guys on Twitter, and you could easily see Justin Jackson becoming a church pastor one day. Zeller was an academic All American... I have always thought you have to have at least one "junkyard dog" on every team...I'm not sure I see one with this group, other than maybe Pinson.

Well, given the fact that Roy recruits a lot of the same kids that end up at duke I'm going to have to disagree with you on that one.

 

[strummingram]

I don't think is completely fair. Fans and alumni can't exactly just pick up and cheer for another team. And I don't think it's wrong to see the good qualities in other coaches and wish that your own coach would emulate some of those.

I was being somewhat facetious. Expecting the coach of your team, who has delivered the goods repeatedly, to "coach more like" some other rival's coach is a foolish endeavor to me. Coach K is an incredible basketball coach. He teaches some shitty techniques, too. Roy Williams coaches his way and that's the way he's always going to coach. I'm sure that dook fans have beefs with K and he's not changing either, nor should he.

This isn't Michigan/Ohio State or Auburn/Alabama in football. They play twice and they play 3-4 times as many regular season games per season.

Last night, a bunch of us were watching this together and I got pissed at the end when we basically had lost and, out of frustration, I shouted "K owns Roy! I can't remember when we beat them the last time!" And, chick's buddy from Lowe's (awesome Tar Heels fan, btw), said "Hey, boy... last year in Durham!" So, there ya go.

 

[TarHeelMark]

That shot didn't end my marriage, but it sure didn't help when I yelled G**D***** at the top of my lungs. Pets scattered, the ex nearly had a heart attack, just a bad scene all around. And I despise that word.

I believe I yelled the same, and like you, despise that word. Of course it woke up the wife and kids, freaked out the dog, etc and generally had me in the dog house for days.

Because of that game (and other family issues) over the last few years, I've worked hard on de-emphasizing how much importance I put on the outcomes of sporting contests.

 

[Blue2010]

Well, given the fact that Roy recruits a lot of the same kids that end up at duke I'm going to have to disagree with you on that one.

Ok, fair enough. The general gist of my comment stands though. Outside of R.McCants, who Roy inherited, you won't find any "Grayson Allen's" on his team. That was my point.

 

[strummingram]

Ok, fair enough. The general gist of my comment stands though. Outside of R.McCants, who Roy inherited, you won't find any "Grayson Allen's" on his team. That was my point.

I think the right players find the right teams/schools, inevitably. With a few exceptions, of course.

 

[gunslingerdick]

Going to address this one -- I am the same way. Between kids, work, home life, etc...I just can't get as hyped for a regular season game as I used to. There were times in college, I would blow a complete gasket over this game. My roommate made a comment one time that pissed me off and I picked up the table in front of him and slammed it on the floor, shattering the thing...right then and there.

I think the tipping point for me was the Rivers shot at the buzzer. I was in a hotel with the family watching that and I nearly ripped the TV off the stand and chunked it out of the room. I think I scared my family that night. lol.

I definitely find myself now though just taking everything in stride b/c I know Roy's approach works in March. Let the fans and ESPN overhype the regular season.... let things play out, Roy's approach will give us a shot in the tourney.

It's called growing up. It happens to most of us. Even as recent as 5-6 years ago, I would rearrange my life to make sure I was going to watch a Heels game. If it wasn't coming on regular cable, I'd go out to a sports bar. I would avoid commitments to others until I figured out my game watching schedule. It was pretty ridiculous. I've missed several games this year - probably 5 or more - just because of commitments with my kids, work or just not feeling like I have to see every single game.

Last year's championship game really reinforced my more mature outlook on it. I had my 5 and 10 year old watching with me so if I melted down, what's that teaching them? I actually prepped them for the Nova win before Jenkins' shot. I made them tell me they'd be ok if he hit a buzzer beater. Now, don't get me wrong, I was extremely disappointed. But there was no yelling, no throwing anything, no tantrums. I simply looked at my kids and said, "next year's our year".

I love Heels sports. But it doesn't in any way define my life like it used to. I've got real life responsibilities that take precedent now. Still want them to win and I still cheer them hard when it's convenient. But my mood isn't really impacted by sports anymore.

 

[tarheel0910]

Ok, fair enough. The general gist of my comment stands though. Outside of R.McCants, who Roy inherited, you won't find any "Grayson Allen's" on his team. That was my point.

You mean besides Will Graves, Larry Drew, the Wear brothers and PJ Hairston?

 

[gunslingerdick]

I don't think is completely fair. Fans and alumni can't exactly just pick up and cheer for another team. And I don't think it's wrong to see the good qualities in other coaches and wish that your own coach would emulate some of those.

I disagree. I root for my teams like I root for my country. Sure, Roy has faults and there are things that privately I'll question. But I never air my grievances in public. In public, Roy, The Heels and 'Murica can do no wrong.

 

[gunslingerdick]

As much as I would love to sit here and tell everyone that it's just another regular season game and that it's not a big deal...sorry, it isn't just another regular season game, and it is a big deal. Whether it should be or not, it is. Want our recruiting to improve? Getting beat by our biggest competition eight miles down the road on a national stage on a regular basis doesn't really help matters much. As much as I wish the media hasn't hyped this game up to be the Super Bowl of the college basketball season, they have, so yeah, it's a big deal. Getting our asses handed to us on such a big stage on a regular basis isn't a good thing, sorry. Is it as important as the tournament? Absolutely not, and I'll even say that I've completely forgotten about the Duke games by the time the tournament starts. Even so, to say that it's just another regular season game is a little ignorant, IMO.

If we win the title this year, no one will care we lost a regular season game to duke. We'll have the upper hand in the rivalry regardless of the head-to-head because of 2 straight FF appearances, the most recent regular season championship and most likely, the most recent ACCT championship. That's what recruits remember a lot more than if we lost to duke for the 11th time out of the last 16 games. Kids' attention span isn't that long. They'll remember that we split with them each of the last 2 years. They don't care what was happening when they were in 9th grade.

 

[gunslingerdick]

You mean besides Will Graves, Larry Drew, the Wear brothers and PJ Hairston?

The Wears don't belong in that statement and I'm not sure Graves does either. Graves wasn't an attitude problem. He smoked weed. And the Wears just didn't want to be so far from home. I hold no grudge towards them.

Drew and Hairston prove your point.

 

[Blue2010]

You mean besides Will Graves, Larry Drew, the Wear brothers and PJ Hairston?

 

[TarHeelMark]

You mean besides Will Graves, Larry Drew, the Wear brothers and PJ Hairston?

I don't recall Graves, Drew, or the Wears acting like a lot of dook punks have over the years; no tripping incidents, broken noses, chest stomps or titty twisters come to mind. That's not to say they didn't have their demons (Will and the weed; PJ and just about every criminal act you can think of), or act like whiny bitches (LDII and the Wears). PJ acted like a punk at times on the court, but for the most part Roy's recruits haven't conducted themselves like some of K's pussies have with unsportsmanlike behavior.

 

[gunslingerdick]

PJ and McCants are the guys to point to for rival fans. And we just have to take it. But even then, I see what Mark is saying. They had their character issues for sure. But it didn't bleed onto the court. Basically, a casual fan would never know that PJ Hairston was an idiot. Whereas the casual fan definitely knows Allen is an idiot because his transgressions happen on the court.

But let's be real here, whereas duke players often look like jackasses on the court - Redick, Leattner, Allen, Singler, Dahntay Jones, etc, none of them are flawed like Hairston. Hairston is a criminal and one of the biggest idiots around. You can't say that about the duke players mentioned.

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

You mean besides Will Graves, Larry Drew, the Wear brothers and PJ Hairston?

I have no issue with Graves. Really have no issue with Hairston either.

Drew and the Wears found their way out of town easy enough that it was no-harm-no-foul there.

In public, Roy, The Heels [...] can do no wrong.

Fair enough - but this is what I, and I feel others, dislike about the Radar crew. I don't think any coach/team is flawless (the Patriots are about as close as you can get, and I still think there are nits that can be picked somewhere with them if you look hard enough.... maybe?)

 

[tarheel0910]

I don't recall Graves, Drew, or the Wears acting like a lot of dook punks have over the years; no tripping incidents, broken noses, chest stomps or titty twisters come to mind. That's not to say they didn't have their demons (Will and the weed; PJ and just about every criminal act you can think of), or act like whiny bitches (LDII and the Wears). PJ acted like a punk at times on the court, but for the most part Roy's recruits haven't conducted themselves like some of K's pussies have with unsportsmanlike behavior.

With maybe the exception of the Wears all of the ones I listed are/were head cases. This is one of my biggest issues with radar, the thought that Roy only plays saints and his players are perfect. That's just not accurate. I'm not trying to say it's his fault, because there is no way he could predict this type of stuff but our players aren't always perfect. All coaches have a few bad eggs if they stick around long enough.

 

[tarheel0910]

I have no issue with Graves. Really have no issue with Hairston either.

Graves was actually one of my favorite players. I liked PJ too except for the off the court crap. Obviously he was more trouble than he was worth though.

Drew and the Wears found their way out of town easy enough that it was no-harm-no-foul there.

You clearly remember nothing about the Drew saga if you think this is true.

Fair enough - but this is what I, and I feel others, dislike about the Radar crew. I don't think any coach/team is flawless

#truth

 

[Blue2010]

In defense, though -- PJ Hairston supposedly came from a very good family and went to a military high school. It would be understandable to have not seen his issues coming.

 

[tarheel0910]

In defense, though -- PJ Hairston supposedly came from a very good family and went to a military high school. It would be understandable to have not seen his issues coming.

No one is blaming Roy. It happens to every coach that's been around for a long time. Like you said, you can't always see these things coming.

 

[strummingram]

I barely even remember winning the ACC Tournament after the first game of the NCAA starts.

 

[gunslingerdick]

In defense, though -- PJ Hairston supposedly came from a very good family and went to a military high school. It would be understandable to have not seen his issues coming.

I don't know his family so I can't speak to that. But he did 1 year at Hargrave Prep. And he was a recruited athlete. It wasn't like he had spent real time in the military school culture. He was there to get stronger and ball out for a year and then bounce. I'm sure Hargrave isn't promoting his existence there.

 

[carolinablue34]

Some of you guys have talked about the anger you felt at losing to dook in the past. I admit it's something I struggle with. Given everything that's happened in the world of sports.

I missed the old Yankee dynasties while watching the Sox come back from 3-0 down. The patriots were a giant turd of a franchise before darth sidious and his sidekick showed up. And up until around 1998, hell even 2009, we had the edge on dook.

How do you guys handle it? It's the worst feeling in the world, and every time I watch a team I hate just steamrolling people it makes my blood boil. I'm the youngest here at 22, and my temper is bad when it comes to sports. Real bad.

 

[Blue2010]

I don't know his family so I can't speak to that. But he did 1 year at Hargrave Prep. And he was a recruited athlete. It wasn't like he had spent real time in the military school culture. He was there to get stronger and ball out for a year and then bounce. I'm sure Hargrave isn't promoting his existence there.

I understand, and a lot of these prep schools operate that way, but I do remember from reading up on him in a prior life when I had the time to follow recruiting...that he came from a good, strong household.

But we're going in circles at this point, so fair enough...

 

[gunslingerdick]

Fair enough - but this is what I, and I feel others, dislike about the Radar crew. I don't think any coach/team is flawless (the Patriots are about as close as you can get, and I still think there are nits that can be picked somewhere with them if you look hard enough.... maybe?)

Amongst fellow Heels fans, we can gave those discussions. I just think it's always important for a fanbase to be united in their support of their team. That's why I hate it when UNC fans go over to DI and feed into some of their shit regarding the scandal or Roy's faults, etc. If you want to talk about those, you do it with other UNC fans. Doing it with rival fanbases exposes us and gives them ammo to create a false narrative.