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OOTB Carolina Basketball Discussion Thread

If you guys enjoy conversing with other fan bases you should post on the main college basketball board. When it's not getting spammed to death by the Chinese it is pretty fun and as long as you aren't overly arrogant (some UK fans) there are good discussions to be had.
 
tw3301 said:
If you guys enjoy conversing with other fan bases you should post on the main college basketball board. When it's not getting spammed to death by the Chinese it is pretty fun and as long as you aren't overly arrogant (some UK fans) there are good discussions to be had.
Click to expand...

Most of us here at OOTB have trouble interacting with people outside our safe space. I doubt you'll see many of us there. But I think you should stop by this board once in a while.
 
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Hark_The_Sound_2010 said:
My bad, figured you were talking about the Knox OV thread. I did just poast in the Alex Murphy thread. Figured it was an olive branch of sorts - as I shat on a dookie, but not any of the ones in the thread.
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I guess I'm on a short leash now because of my last few posts in this thread. I didn't get an explanation of why I was locked out. I don't think anything I said was out of line and their were some posts that were out of line in my opinion, but I don't have any power. I don't plan on being over there as much or maybe not at all after that though. I guess that will make them happy. I'll have to rely on @BillyL to keep me up to date on UNC basketball. ;)
 
tw3301 is a good one. Always enjoy conversing with him and reading his stuff on the basketball board. It is true about the Chinese though, lol.
 
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tarheel0910 said:
I've got no problem with you stopping by as long as you don't compliment @gunslingerdick . His ego is big enough as is.
Click to expand...
Seven likes and counting for this post. Maybe instead of a like train thread we could get a thread going that does nothing but insult @gunslingerdick . It's obvious that people like hating on him and apparently you can get a lot of likes for it.
 
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tarheel0910 said:
Seven likes and counting for this post. Maybe instead of a like train thread we could get a thread going that does nothing but insult @gunslingerdick . It's obvious that people like hating on him and apparently you can get a lot of likes for it.
Click to expand...

But people also like liking on me as well. The original poast that you referenced has likes in the double digits. So there.

Don't hate me because I'm well-liked.
 
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So, what's up with Roy offering all of these recruits that are way lower than normal for us? Is he not feeling good about PJ or Knox at this point? It seems like he is reaching with some of these guys. I don't mind a project type player like Joel James, but these guys are a lot further down the list than he was. Our front court depth is very thin the next couple of years so we are going to need to get some players that can contribute in a big way on day one.
 
tarheel0910 said:
So, what's up with Roy offering all of these recruits that are way lower than normal for us? Is he not feeling good about PJ or Knox at this point? It seems like he is reaching with some of these guys. I don't mind a project type player like Joel James, but these guys are a lot further down the list than he was. Our front court depth is very thin the next couple of years so we are going to need to get some players that can contribute in a big way on day one.
Click to expand...

It is strange. I don't really see it as indication that Roy doesn't feel good about PJ or Knox though. I just think his plan is to sign one of Brooks, Stokes or Manley and then have a scholarship left over certainly for PJ and then one most likely would be available in the event that Knox wanted to sign also. If PJ goes elsewhere, then maybe Roy takes two of the Stokes, Brooks, Manley trio and then just saves a scholarship for 2018. Roy has had to change the way he recruits. He's finally realized that we're not going to be signing many of the super elite OAD type players and so he's trying to find guys that will be here for several years and will fit his system exactly how he wants them to.

But I have a good feeling on PJ. I think we ultimately get him. And I think our 2017 class will be:
PJ
Huffman
Manley
Platek
Felton

And I'd be pleased with that.
 
If, we are going to get 1 of PJ or Kevin, I believe our chances are far better with Knox.

I'm of the thought that PJ will end up at UK.
 
I dont buy this "uk hype machine" theory being floated where supposedly they purposefully and in an organized manner promote that recruits are favoring them when they really dont know one way or another. Whats to be gained by that? If i'm a recruit and a school falsely claims im favoring them i would be pissed.
 
gunslingerdick said:
It is strange. I don't really see it as indication that Roy doesn't feel good about PJ or Knox though. I just think his plan is to sign one of Brooks, Stokes or Manley and then have a scholarship left over certainly for PJ and then one most likely would be available in the event that Knox wanted to sign also. If PJ goes elsewhere, then maybe Roy takes two of the Stokes, Brooks, Manley trio and then just saves a scholarship for 2018. Roy has had to change the way he recruits. He's finally realized that we're not going to be signing many of the super elite OAD type players and so he's trying to find guys that will be here for several years and will fit his system exactly how he wants them to.

But I have a good feeling on PJ. I think we ultimately get him. And I think our 2017 class will be:
PJ
Huffman
Manley
Platek
Felton

And I'd be pleased with that.
Click to expand...
Most years I would agree with that, but over the next couple of years we are going to have a lot less depth than normal. There is no guarantee that Meeks all of a sudden figures out how to play a full season and Hicks can play more than two minutes without fouling out. These recruits are going to have to get a lot of minutes. I never expect Roy to bring in multiple top ten guys because that's is not the norm for him (I think you showed some stats for that a while back), but are these really the best we can do? Is there really not one or two players with more potential that we would have a shot at?
 
heelmanwilm said:
I dont buy this "uk hype machine" theory being floated where supposedly they purposefully and in an organized manner promote that recruits are favoring them when they really dont know one way or another. Whats to be gained by that? If i'm a recruit and a school falsely claims im favoring them i would be pissed.
Click to expand...
I don't think it's any kind of collective effort, but I could see why certain people with strong ties to the program would do that. Like you, I don't really see anything meaningful that you could gain from that.
 
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This my opinion. Nothing to base it from except what I see.
UNC is not a brand anymore. Kids simply don't desire to be here. (Mainly top recruits)
There has been much speculation about why, and I feel that most of those opinions are true. It's becoming very obvious that kids are looking for something else besides what UNC is offering. Yes, we made it to the championship game. But that core group caught so much crap from fans and media mainly due to the fact that they weathered the academic storm. UNC has been thru a tough stretch.
I really feel they will be forced to modernize their approach to recruiting to get back on top.
I feel Roy is doing the best he can. He won't buy into the new fads and trends.
I'll give you a prime example. I created a thread about the new NBA video game that's been released. Coach K is featured in that commercial. How many recruits play that game? I made that poast, not to knock on k. It's marketing genius. Also given that he coaches every year for the Olympics. All within the boundaries of NCAA rules.
Calipari broke the mold for classic one and done when he went to Kentucky. How many of the top 20 players have landed at those schools in recent years?
Fans feel that the school will be selling their souls to have that kind of image.

I'm not saying we need that approach. But we do need some attractive token to gain the attention of other schools. I posted this on raidar 2 years ago and was roasted for it.
 
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Grayhead said:
This my opinion. Nothing to base it from except what I see.
UNC is not a brand anymore. Kids simply don't desire to be here. (Mainly top recruits)
There has been much speculation about why, and I feel that most of those opinions are true. It's becoming very obvious that kids are looking for something else besides what UNC is offering. Yes, we made it to the championship game. But that core group caught so much crap from fans and media mainly due to the fact that they weathered the academic storm. UNC has been thru a tough stretch.
I really feel they will be forced to modernize their approach to recruiting to get back on top.
I feel Roy is doing the best he can. He won't buy into the new fads and trends.
I'll give you a prime example. I created a thread about the new NBA video game that's been released. Coach K is featured in that commercial. How many recruits play that game? I made that poast, not to knock on k. It's marketing genius. Also given that he coaches every year for the Olympics. All within the boundaries of NCAA rules.
Calipari broke the mold for classic one and done when he went to Kentucky. How many of the top 20 players have landed at those schools in recent years?
Fans feel that the school will be selling their souls to have that kind of image.

I'm not saying we need that approach. But we do need some attractive token to gain the attention of other schools. I posted this on raidar 2 years ago and was roasted for it.
Click to expand...
I still think we are a brand, but I agree with pretty much everything else you said. If we can get one elite recruit to come in and be a OAD then I think the situation improves drastically. One of the biggest things that work against Roy is the fact that he hasn't produced a OAD since the new rules started. If we can get one to come in I think that will change the game. I'm not expecting a OAD every year, but if we can pull one in every 2-3 years I think that would do wonders for the program.
 
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Grayhead said:
This my opinion. Nothing to base it from except what I see.
UNC is not a brand anymore. Kids simply don't desire to be here. (Mainly top recruits)
There has been much speculation about why, and I feel that most of those opinions are true. It's becoming very obvious that kids are looking for something else besides what UNC is offering. Yes, we made it to the championship game. But that core group caught so much crap from fans and media mainly due to the fact that they weathered the academic storm. UNC has been thru a tough stretch.
I really feel they will be forced to modernize their approach to recruiting to get back on top.
I feel Roy is doing the best he can. He won't buy into the new fads and trends.
I'll give you a prime example. I created a thread about the new NBA video game that's been released. Coach K is featured in that commercial. How many recruits play that game? I made that poast, not to knock on k. It's marketing genius. Also given that he coaches every year for the Olympics. All within the boundaries of NCAA rules.
Calipari broke the mold for classic one and done when he went to Kentucky. How many of the top 20 players have landed at those schools in recent years?
Fans feel that the school will be selling their souls to have that kind of image.

I'm not saying we need that approach. But we do need some attractive token to gain the attention of other schools. I posted this on raidar 2 years ago and was roasted for it.
Click to expand...
Well said and agree completely.

I still think UNC is a brand, just not a very attractive one right now, as much as it disgusts me to say that.
 
Well, by brand I would say at the top of recruits list.
Roy isn't built for one and done. He recruits for sustainability first, then long term. We all assumed Barnes was one and done, but that wasn't the case. How many have we produced in the last 10 years? That tells the story there. Elite kids don't have the patience to wait 3 years in college. Instant gratification. I will go on a limb and say that as long as Roy is our coach, it will remain like this.
Barnes is our only top player to make it to the finals in recent years. And he was subpar for the most part this last year. When a team looks to move you to make room for a better player, then people notice.
Roy needs to land that top recruit one time, have him stay a year and dominate, then head to the NBA and start. We will be considered then.
 
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Grayhead said:
This my opinion. Nothing to base it from except what I see.
UNC is not a brand anymore. Kids simply don't desire to be here. (Mainly top recruits)
There has been much speculation about why, and I feel that most of those opinions are true. It's becoming very obvious that kids are looking for something else besides what UNC is offering. Yes, we made it to the championship game. But that core group caught so much crap from fans and media mainly due to the fact that they weathered the academic storm. UNC has been thru a tough stretch.
I really feel they will be forced to modernize their approach to recruiting to get back on top.
I feel Roy is doing the best he can. He won't buy into the new fads and trends.
I'll give you a prime example. I created a thread about the new NBA video game that's been released. Coach K is featured in that commercial. How many recruits play that game? I made that poast, not to knock on k. It's marketing genius. Also given that he coaches every year for the Olympics. All within the boundaries of NCAA rules.
Calipari broke the mold for classic one and done when he went to Kentucky. How many of the top 20 players have landed at those schools in recent years?
Fans feel that the school will be selling their souls to have that kind of image.

I'm not saying we need that approach. But we do need some attractive token to gain the attention of other schools. I posted this on raidar 2 years ago and was roasted for it.
Click to expand...


Great poast. I agree with it all - even the part that coolwater and tarheel0910 don't agree with - that UNC is not a top brand right now. I say "right now" rather than the way you put which was "anymore". Because by saying anymore, you're assuming we won't be again. I think we will. But I think it will be after the Roy era. Roy is who he is and he isn't going to change. K adapted. Cal adapted. Other coaches adapted. Roy hasn't and won't to the degree that will make us attractive to OAD players. Whether you like that or not is an all together different discussion. But the fact remains that Roy's recruiting style, his preferred style of play and his overall demeanor and the way he sees college basketball are not meshing with today's kids.

We love Roy for who he is. But we have to take the good with the bad (although I admit that's all perception - because I personally don't have a problem with the way our program is run right now).
 
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Yea i agree that our "brand" is not appealing to the current culture that these kids are in. its all marketing. Coach fedora is doing a good job
Marketing the fb program as current and lit. Coach williams aint gonna go there. Shaka smart and the ariz coach are. Michael jordan used to be "lit" and as the face of our program drew all the elite players with his image. Todays players never saw him play. Our bball program has no face now except coach williams and lets face it, that country boy aww shucks demeanor has limitations. Not that i want him gone, i dont. It is what it is.
 
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Grayhead said:
Well, by brand I would say at the top of recruits list
Click to expand...
Ok, if you are talking about recruiting then yes I would agree with you

heelmanwilm said:
Michael jordan used to be "lit" and as the face of our program drew all the elite players with his image. Todays players never saw him play.
Click to expand...
Going to have to disagree with this a little. Jordan still carries major weight in the world of sports. A lot of these high school guys have watched him on film. I'd also be willing to bet almost all of these recruits are wearing Jordan's on and/or off the court.
 
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tarheel0910 said:
Ok, if you are talking about recruiting then yes I would agree with you


Going to have to disagree with this a little. Jordan still carries major weight in the world of sports. A lot of these high school guys have watched him on film. I'd also be willing to bet almost all of these recruits are wearing Jordan's on and/or off the court.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but I get his point. Jordan is too far removed from his playing days to be as big of a recruiting factor as he once was. He last played in 2003. The kids we're recruiting were at best 5 years old then. They only know the legend of Jordan.
 
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Yeah, kids today can no longer relate to the G.O.A.T. or any of the other legends who played with him at UNC. I mean, a lot of these kids are too young to have been able to catch Jamison, Carter, Sheed, Stack, and all the other UNC superstars from the 90s that were equally, if not more, impactful in the NBA than in college. They only remember the UNC players from the 2000s and up who, for the most part, were extremely effective on the college level, but not as much in the NBA, and make no mistake about it, that's an issue. I'm not knocking Hansbrough, Lawson, Ellington, Felton, May, and all those guys, by any means. Some of those are my favorite UNC players ever. Just saying the recruits notice...
 
coolwaterunc said:
They only remember the UNC players from the 2000s and up who, for the most part, were extremely effective on the college level, but not as much in the NBA, and make no mistake about it, that's an issue. I'm not knocking Hansbrough, Lawson, Ellington, Felton, May, and all those guys, by any means. Some of those are my favorite UNC players ever. Just saying the recruits notice...
Click to expand...

Nailed-It.gif
 
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Just to add a little more to get a realization of how young these kids are...the incoming 2017 freshmen class was just 6 years old in 2005 and 10 in 2009. Hard to believe how young they are, but it's true. They just weren't around to see UNC players dominate the way they did.
 
heelmanwilm said:
I dont buy this "uk hype machine" theory being floated where supposedly they purposefully and in an organized manner promote that recruits are favoring them when they really dont know one way or another. Whats to be gained by that? If i'm a recruit and a school falsely claims im favoring them i would be pissed.
Click to expand...
Gary said it so it's true.
 
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You guys pretty much nailed it. I've been hypothesizing for a while now why our recruiting has taken a hit. At first I thought it was merely the academic stuff. Now it's much more brand and changing times. And I completely concur that Roy won't change, he is who he is, and we might have to wait until after he retires to start adjusting accordingly.

I love Roy, and I love him as our coach. He's his own man and I respect that. But as was pointed out before, K and Cal both adapted, Roy hasn't. We have to live with that.
 
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