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OOTB Carolina Basketball Discussion Thread

So manek is a head scratcher for me. He isnt new to basketball. New team, New system, but not the game overall. I thought he would be a stabilizing force, and a starter by now. I guess he has to find his shot to be what he suppose to be. He seems frustrated to me. Always hesitates for a second on a miss, which gives the opposition a step on him.

Another concern is scoring. We haven't really filled the basket at any consistency. We have 5 in our rotation that could score double figures easy. Is Hubert looking for more of a Virginia style of play? To me, fast tempo and fast breaks are only implemented when it's a golden opportunity, and not the main staple. I see a lot of half court sets, and deep shot clocks attempts.

Where have we improved since game 1?
 
tarheel0910 said:
That's the norm for the ACC now. That's why I keep saying we can probably make it to the tournament just because the ACC is trash.
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ACC will continue to backslide in basketball and football due to revenue disparity between it and the SEC and B1G. We can't get out of this conference fast enough.

If we lose an ACC game to someone not named VT or Duke, it will wreck our NET and put us on the bubble.
 
Grayhead said:
So manek is a head scratcher for me. He isnt new to basketball. New team, New system, but not the game overall. I thought he would be a stabilizing force, and a starter by now. I guess he has to find his shot to be what he suppose to be. He seems frustrated to me. Always hesitates for a second on a miss, which gives the opposition a step on him.

Another concern is scoring. We haven't really filled the basket at any consistency. We have 5 in our rotation that could score double figures easy. Is Hubert looking for more of a Virginia style of play? To me, fast tempo and fast breaks are only implemented when it's a golden opportunity, and not the main staple. I see a lot of half court sets, and deep shot clocks attempts.

Where have we improved since game 1?
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Our +/- is significantly better when Manek is on the court. Significantly.
 
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TarHeelNation11 said:
Our +/- is significantly better when Manek is on the court. Significantly.
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I agree, he fills space well. But given his experience, he should dominate. If his shot starts falling with more consistent, then we will be better equipped for the journey.
Right now we average 78 pages. Roy's teams averaged around 86. Last night turnovers killed that. Defense is important. Roy turned Defense into offense. Hubert really hasnt/doesn't do that yet. I would love to see what a true PG would do with this roster.
 
Grayhead said:
I agree, he fills space well. But given his experience, he should dominate. If his shot starts falling with more consistent, then we will be better equipped for the journey.
Right now we average 78 pages. Roy's teams averaged around 86. Last night turnovers killed that. Defense is important. Roy turned Defense into offense. Hubert really hasnt/doesn't do that yet. I would love to see what a true PG would do with this roster.
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We are a bad team. You should adjust your expectations accordingly.
 
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TarHeelNation11 said:
ACC will continue to backslide in basketball and football due to revenue disparity between it and the SEC and B1G. We can't get out of this conference fast enough.
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Won't make you happy though, because that confrence will be the Big 10
TarHeelNation11 said:
If we lose an ACC game to someone not named VT or Duke, it will wreck our NET and put us on the bubble.
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Absolutely agree it will wreck our NET, but our name will keep us in it. We will just be a 8-12 seed.
 
Grayhead said:
I wouldn't call it unfaithful. Spoiled, yes. Noone wants to see UNC as a mid major.
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The days of us dominating and finishing in the top 3 of the ACC annually ended years ago. The basketball landscape has changed. And no power teams of old dominate like they did in the past. Too many transfers, too many OADs and a different, lesser brand of basketball is played these days. Kids' emphasis isn't on the things it used to be. I saw a quote a few days ago from Lou Holtz that said: "players now are concerned with rights and privileges whereas they used to concerned with responsibilities and obligations." It's true. It's a different breed of athlete now and not the kind conducive to building a team and consistently winning. We won't slip to a mid major program but we won't win at the level we used to. No one will.
 
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The Kentucky game was rough. They got out played in every aspect of the game, especially effort. But up until that game I felt like this team was better than the last two teams Roy had. That's not saying much but it wouldn't make sense to expect Hubert's first team to be great when the last two teams before he took over were horrendous.

When Manek heats up from outside he's a monster. He's tall and has a very quick release. He's also been a pretty good rebounder at times.
 
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gunslingerdick said:
The days of us dominating and finishing in the top 3 of the ACC ended years ago. The basketball landscape has changed. And no power teams of old dominate like they did in the past. Too many transfers, too many OADs and a different, lesser brand of basketball is played these days. Kids' emphasis isn't on the things it used to be. I saw a quote a few days ago from Lou Holtz that said: "players now are concerned with rights and privileges whereas they used to concerned with responsibilities and obligations." It's true. It's a different breed of athlete now and not the kind conducive to building a team and consistently winning. We won't slip to a mid major program but we won't win at the level we used to. No one will.
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This take is depressing. Money has sold out the collegiate athlete. I guess that's why it's been hard to get excited about sports as a whole. It's suppose to be an escape, not a platform. NIL is allowing a highest bidder scenario. NCAA bias started our decent. It's hard watching and hoping they produce.
 
Grayhead said:
This take is depressing. Money has sold out the collegiate athlete. I guess that's why it's been hard to get excited about sports as a whole. It's suppose to be an escape, not a platform. NIL is allowing a highest bidder scenario. NCAA bias started our decent. It's hard watching and hoping they produce.
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Hubert will say things like "I don't get it...", referring to the players not feeling a devotion or inherent sort of pride to have that "North Carolina" on your uniform. He even said that "it's not like when I was playing for the team."

He's absolutely right... it's not. They don't really feel an honor, or humbled by the school and its legacy. They are looking for the vehicle that will advance their personal agenda and their potential value. That runs totally counter to "can I preserve the school's character and the legacy of this basketball program, and advance this team?"

I'm not entirely sure that he's able to be a present-day kind of coach that can get results from these new sort of values in players. It's turned from "I need the school" to "the school needs me." In a way, Davis might already be as obsolete as Roy Williams.
 
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strummingram said:
Hubert will say things like "I don't get it...", referring to the players not feeling a devotion or inherent sort of pride to have that "North Carolina" on your uniform. He even said that "it's not like when I was playing for the team."

He's absolutely right... it's not. They don't really feel an honor, or humbled by the school and its legacy. They are looking for the vehicle that will advance their personal agenda and their potential value. That runs totally counter to "can I preserve the school's character and the legacy of this basketball program, and advance this team?"

I'm not entirely sure that he's able to be a present-day kind of coach that can get results from these new sort of values in players. It's turned from "I need the school" to "the school needs me." In a way, Davis might already be as obsolete as Roy Williams.
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So the Carolina way is a much watered down version. Sucks
 
Grayhead said:
So the Carolina way is a much watered down version. Sucks
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It's just how things are pretty much anywhere.

ETA: It appaears to be the case. I may be projecting on some level. I'm not around these kids in person, so I can only speculate. I'm going by Hubert's comments.
 
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strummingram said:
It's just how things are pretty much anywhere.

ETA: It appaears to be the case. I may be projecting on some level. I'm not around these kids in person, so I can only speculate. I'm going by Hubert's comments.
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I agree with your comments on this thread, but there are some schools which over recent memory have been able to succeed in this new environment, with their existing established coach. I'm thinking Nova, Gonzaga, Baylor, UVA to an extent.

I'm not saying we want to "be like them", and of those four schools I think only Baylor's coach is one we'd have had any shot at prying away.... but what do these coaches have or do, that we do not, in terms of relating to the kids and most importantly getting the most out of the kids and the team, in this current "its all about me the individual player" environment?
 
Heelicious said:
I agree with your comments on this thread, but there are some schools which over recent memory have been able to succeed in this new environment, with their existing established coach. I'm thinking Nova, Gonzaga, Baylor, UVA to an extent.

I'm not saying we want to "be like them", and of those four schools I think only Baylor's coach is one we'd have had any shot at prying away.... but what do these coaches have or do, that we do not, in terms of relating to the kids and most importantly getting the most out of the kids and the team, in this current "its all about me the individual player" environment?
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Yeah, that's a good point/analogy. Which teams appear to be a reflection of the "old style", for lack of a better term. I think camaraderie is absolutely necessary. I'm not sure about UVA this year, but Bennett is able to recruit players to execute his style of winning basketball. They may not be 5 star players and get all the accolades and attention before they show-up on campus. I think those are more likely to accomplish the older style of wining styles. I look at the dookies or KY and see a style that caters to the individuals much more.

Maybe Hubert will eventually be able to find players that can execute a style of play, and winning, that reflects the Dean Smith style. I don't know what Davis is like in person, or in a team/practice/game setting. He may not have the temperament. Or... his temperament might work, eventually. But, he has to get his guys and learn his own coaching style. I don't know if UNC fans are patient enough to wait.
 
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This day-and-age... the whole thing is totally different. This transfer portal has made the game entirely different. Can coaches push players like they used to? They can get pissed and leave. Or... their PARENTS are watching and think THEY know better than the coaches. Social media is a huge force and coaches have to please so many people at one time. It's a crazy juggling act. And, when you're Davis, who is learning it all for the first time? I feel for the guy. I really hope those assistants are helping out. ETA: And, when you have all of this "new-ness", it makes me wonder how wise this whole "Carolina Guys Only" is a wise choice. It looks good... IF YOU WIN A LOT!
 
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strummingram said:
This day-and-age... the whole thing is totally different. This transfer portal has made the game entirely different. Can coaches push players like they used to? They can get pissed and leave. Or... their PARENTS are watching and think THEY know better than the coaches. Social media is a huge force and coaches have to please so many people at one time. It's a crazy juggling act. And, when you're Davis, who is learning it all for the first time? I feel for the guy. I really hope those assistants are helping out.
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Yes -
And I could type pages on this, but I won't.

I am 54 and I will make a "back in my day" statement that will make me sound like an old codger.

But all of society (now), for kids growing up now, is so "ego / self / entitlement / instant gratification / lack of hard work or sacrifice" - driven.

You're right that a lot of that is driven by social media, you also mentioned parents which can be a big problem, if they worship or idolize their children, and do too much for them, instead of teaching their kids via tough love, and making their kids become independently responsible with strong work ethic and sacrifice; not as parents expecting everything in life to be instantly given to the kids, and the parents themselves doing or facilitating the giving.

This sort of mentality definitely only hurts kids in real life in the medium and long term. Eventually everyone is mugged by reality and truth.

And unfortunately putting this ego and entitlement attitude and mindset in kids sets them on a path that nothing in life needs to be worked hard at to earn, or requires sacrifice, whether that is career-based, sticking it out in a challenging marriage, having and raising kids right, serving the community, etc.
 
strummingram said:
This day-and-age... the whole thing is totally different. This transfer portal has made the game entirely different. Can coaches push players like they used to? They can get pissed and leave. Or... their PARENTS are watching and think THEY know better than the coaches. Social media is a huge force and coaches have to please so many people at one time. It's a crazy juggling act. And, when you're Davis, who is learning it all for the first time? I feel for the guy. I really hope those assistants are helping out. ETA: And, when you have all of this "new-ness", it makes me wonder how wise this whole "Carolina Guys Only" is a wise choice. It looks good... IF YOU WIN A LOT!
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You just gave a lot of reasons to hire a younger coach. A younger coach should, in theory, be able to handle those easier because they came up in a different world than someone like Hubert. There were many reasons not to hire Hubert. Age was one of them.

It still makes no sense to me that we didn't hire Wes. I don't think he would have been the best possible hire, but if you are going to only hire UNC guys, then he is easily the best choice. Hubert was way down the list of people who should have been considered.
 
tarheel0910 said:
You just gave a lot of reasons to hire a younger coach. A younger coach should, in theory, be able to handle those easier because they came up in a different world than someone like Hubert. There were many reasons not to hire Hubert. Age was one of them.

It still makes no sense to me that we didn't hire Wes. I don't think he would have been the best possible hire, but if you are going to only hire UNC guys, then he is easily the best choice. Hubert was way down the list of people who should have been considered.
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Yeah, it could be a new trend. I don't really know. I'm speculating with every comment. I mean, how young and inexperienced do you go?
 
S
strummingram said:
Yeah, it could be a new trend. I don't really know. I'm speculating with every comment. I mean, how young and inexperienced do you go?
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Scheyer young guess.
UNc followed the recommendations of a coach that past his prime and was ready to move on. Just like Dean, knowing the game was past him. Unlike Dean, Roy had to deal with all the BS strum has mentioned, on top of getting knocked off the recruiting pedestal that seemed to linger forever. Hubert is Roy's choice. Can UNC wait to see if he becomes another great? Who knows. They seem to be better than last year. That is a plus. Still questioning just how much have we improved this many games in.
 
Grayhead said:
S

Scheyer young guess.
UNc followed the recommendations of a coach that past his prime and was ready to move on. Just like Dean, knowing the game was past him. Unlike Dean, Roy had to deal with all the BS strum has mentioned, on top of getting knocked off the recruiting pedestal that seemed to linger forever. Hubert is Roy's choice. Can UNC wait to see if he becomes another great? Who knows. They seem to be better than last year. That is a plus. Still questioning just how much have we improved this many games in.
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I think Scheyer will do just fine.
 
Grayhead said:
He should, their brand and payment methods are airtight!!!
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Branding is one of the things that has hurt us recently. We haven't done a good job at showing we're the cool school. I'm not really sure if we ever were though. The success of our pro players was what gave us the cool factor. We don't really have that anymore.
 
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TarHeelNation11 said:
Settle down, McClellan. Why would I be "faithful" to a HC that has coached 12 more games than I have in CBB?
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conor-mc-gregor-who-the-fook-is-that-guy.gif
 
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Watching Clemson beat the piss out of UVA, in Charlottesville. I dunno what to make of Virginia. The Cavs lost by 17 to the Tigers.
 
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